Pixel 9 Pro XL Review Comparison: Pickr vs ART [Video]

What happens when two award-winning tech journalists get together to compare review notes about the Google Pixel 9 Pro XL?

That’s what I wanted to find out, so I invited award-winning tech journalist Leigh Stark from Pickr to chat with me about our differing experiences with Google’s new flagship phone — the good, the bad, and the ugly.

In this context, Leigh is probably the good and I’m the ugly, in case that wasn’t clear.

You can (and should!) read Leigh’s excellent review of the Pixel 9 Pro XL over on Pickr here.

Want my review? You can find my review of the Pixel 9 Pro XL right here.

Pixel 9 Pro Reviews Video Transcript:

Alex: So, right about now, you’re probably faced with well let’s face it hundreds if not thousands of Google Pixel 9 Pro XL reviews because the embargo has lifted and honestly whilst I’d love it if people read my reviews and watched my reviews, they shouldn’t do that exclusively.

So I’m joined here today by award-winning Tech journal and another man who has also reviewed the pixel 9 Pro XL, from Pickr, it’s Leigh Stark! Hi Leigh!

Leigh: Hey, how you going?

Alex: Not bad. I am a little tired. I’ve been working very hard on this one as have you. So let’s jump right into it. We’re not just to be clear with people. We are not going to be reviewing the phones here on this particular stream. Instead we’re going to be comparing notes because what happens with the reviewers I find is that everyone has a slightly different experience. Obviously people have different world views but what you find from a phone can be different and that can have a lot of utility for different people and their needs. Would you agree Leigh?

Leigh: Yeah, mostly. I mean I I find in general a lot of reviews tend to be very similar. So if you read Alex’s, you’ll probably find similar notes to what’s in mine. But some of the little key things will stand out about our users or experience to be honest.

Alex: Yeah, absolutely. There’s a certain amount of subjectivity to a review, and that should be expected and in fact, that can be really beneficial. So, let’s jump right into it. First of all, let’s talk about the design. I think we’re basically on an accord here.

Leigh: Yeah. It’s a nice design but it’s also one that borrows very prominently from from phones we’ve seen the past. I mean Samsung has been doing the flattened edge for a while. Apple’s been doing it. This is kind of borrowing from that theme but that’s not a bad thing. There’s only so many ways you can I guess design a phone at this point in time. It’s kind of the, the thing I find interesting is that the thickness which is actually not far off Apple’s one is actually slightly more when you notice the extrusion on the back,

Alex: Yeah, well, I think that the camera bar becoming a camera pill, camera stadium, there’s a couple of different terms for a rounded rectaangle, basically, but the camera bar change. I thought I was going to like it a lot more. I kind of find now that I’m just ignoring it, it’s just there, it’s not a bad thing. It’s just kind of there, and I guess if you’re a Pixel phone upgrader, it might be a little annoying because you’re going to have to upgrade your case.

Leigh: Yeah, there’s that. One of the things I liked about it is that when you lay it flat on a surface, it doesn’t actually technically lay flat, it lies on an incline. One of the things I actually like about it is that it’s actually fairly stable. I didn’t have that… for instance with there was a phone I reviewed this year from Asus, the ZenPhone 11 Ultra and I found that every time I touched the phone, if it was on the surface, it would kind of bend almost like it was the chair leg that wasn’t sitting there properly. Google has done a good job of balancing this, as you said before you still kind of need a new case you probably would have anyway because the flat edges would have changed it. But yeah, it’s it’s not a bad design. It just reminds me of kind of like what Google would do if they interpreted the iPhone.

Alex: I mean, we should also talk colours because, well, I have the pink one. I’m not a big fan, I think this is not the colour I would choose however, as anyone who’s watched any of my phone reviews, will know I favour cases and this thing’s going in a case right now.

Leigh: Now that’s so interesting because they sent me the greenish looking one, but the pink case.

Alex: So they did that with the pixel 9 that they sent me, they sent me the pink case for that. So someone in Google Australia is just having a lot of fun, sending these devices out in mixed range colours.

Leigh: I actually kind of wanted the pink one but only because I was kind of curious what it looked like we should do a trade next time. I’m worried though that my girls would end up taking it because every time they saw the pink case on the greenish phone they kept on trying to steal the pink case with the greenish phone in it.

Alex: The cases match the colours pretty closely. So you probably don’t need to borrow this to know that it’s very, very pink. And for some people that will be great, of course. But the design is, it’s fine. I do like the fact that we get Choice in sizes without particular compromises, obviously the regular 9 Pro has a smaller screen, smaller battery. It’s not like it’s got different cameras. It’s not like it’s got a degraded processor or anything like that, although neither of us have been able to actually test that nine Pros yet.

Leigh: Yeah, it it’s also the fact we’ve not been able to benchmark it properly either which is one of the things that bothers me about when Google releases these phones. It takes a while for Google to actually authorise or approve Geekbench or any of the other benchmarking applications. So it’s difficult to know how much faster for instance this device is but yeah, early release. It’s a nice looking phone. I don’t think like, I’ve been using it both with the case and without the case at times, I think it’s a really elegant looking phone. It feels really good in the hands as well. It’s slippery, which is a downside again

Alex: Cases cases, cases cases people!

Leigh: But yes, you definitely want the case, but they say it’s more durable. I’m not willing to drop this phone because I’m not someone who likes durability testing my devices. Uh, but if you do drop it Google says it’s strurdier than last year. So… yay until you buy a new one, I guess?

Alex: Yay until you break it. They say it’s like twice as durable and like it’s still IP68, it’s not IP 136 because that doesn’t exist to people but yeah, until you break it although look you mentioned that the benchmarking and performance stuff. So we may as well jump over to that because this was the year where my patience with that — and Google honestly it I can’t see another reason other than Google playing games to obfuscate, Tensor’s actual performance potential, Tensor G4 for these phones, of course, because this always happens about a month after these phones come out suddenly benchmarks are available for them. And we saw this, I mean most blatantly with like the pixel 8A which is the tensor G3 phone. Same as the pixel 8 but the 8A couldn’t run those benchmarks and the Pixel 8 could until about a month after. So I sideloaded, just to get a kind of comparative picture with the asterisk that they’re not quite final Benchmark scores.

Leigh: Yeah. What did your Benchmark say in close proximity to the Tensor G3 versus G4?

Alex: So it’s faster than the G3 which it should be, more towards multi-core operation than single core, but single core operation across most of these phones is

Leigh: Yeah, it’s fast. It’s consistent these days.

Alex: Yeah, absolutely. It’s faster than that but it’s still well behind the Galaxy S24 Ultra and especially, of course, the iPhones, where Apple’s had a big performance advantage over its rivals for quite some time now. And I think my big problem with that is not so much, ‘oh it’s not as fast’ because I kind of forgave that on the pixel 8 Pro. It’s the fact that this is now a much more expensive phone as well.

Leigh: I can see that problem. I can also see the issue with simply if it’s slower, I mean a lot of people use their devices more than just apps. Apps are single core. Multi-core phone, whatever. It’s when you get into areas like games that rely on graphical prowess when it’s much further behind and you’re still charging that same premium. That’s where I start to raise the red flags about things because Samsung’s s24, Ultra is a fast phone this year thanks to the Snapdragon 8 gen 3, and the iPhone last year was fast. We can expect whatever the new chip. We’re getting this year will be equally fast but to have this thing slower in every aspect is kind of a problem long term because you do expect your phone to last with you several years, especially when it’s being advertised with seven years of updates.

Alex: Yeah. And I mean the S24s are really good contrast there, of course, because Samsung’s doing that as well. They won’t have Android upgrades as fast as Google because they’re Google, but they will have them and on a phone that’s going to feel current and timely for a fair while longer than this will. I I do think this is a problem that Google hasn’t quite solved. Google’s pitch with this is that AI will solve everything. Leigh, will AI solve everything?

Leigh: Well, based on the time we’ve spent with this, I don’t know what AI solves on this phone, let alone AI solving everything in general. There are some clever ideas here don’t get me wrong. So it’s probably worth talking about the AI.
This is an AI phone and everything that Google does is AI these days. That’s the reason why the Chromecast is disappearing to make way for the TV streamer, because it’s got AI in it as well. So Google’s doubling down on AI, shock horror, but this has AI features for a lot of image editing, which may or may not be useful. It’s got AI editing for generating wallpapers, which in fairness, every phone company is trying.

Alex: Yeah, that’s, that’s not a new feature.

Leigh: It’s got AI for voice transcriptions, got AI for noise, reduction in movies and things like that. But it also has AI for screenshots and that might be the most useful form of AI I’ve seen in the phone in a while, which is a specific to pixel at the moment. But it makes me wonder for how much longer. It’s a feature that allows you to, every time you capture a screenshot, it analyses, what’s in that screenshot and kind of turns it into text and allowing you to add it to other things later on.

Alex: Yeah, I like this, I did see it described as kind of Google’s take on Microsoft’s Recall, a feature which I really didn’t like, but then recall is constant and always screenshotting everything you do. This is screenshot on demand. You take a screenshot and then it will work with it. Which I think is a smarter more user-centric approach. But then you’ve also got AI features like Gemini Advanced so you get 12 months of Gemini Advanced when you get this phone and this is meant to be Google’s more conversational AI bot.

Leigh: It’s ChatGPT for Google basically.

Alex: Yeah I’ve had some pretty weird conversations with Gemini Advanced and I don’t think that’s just because I’m a weird guy, though I am. What’s your experience been like Leigh?

Leigh: I used it a few times and found it wasn’t actually helpful for my life. I also found I didn’t actually understand who I was. I had to start training it again, which I thought was weird, given I’ve been using clearly, I’ve been reviewing Google devices since Android was a thing and I found it really quite remarkable that I was still training it to actually respond to me at times. I I like I said this, in my review, I don’t know whether AI is actually genuinely useful in a phone. Yet it might take a lot more time, but I wouldn’t buy this phone on the pretence that I’m buying at the AI. I’d buy it because it’s a good phone, not an AI phone.

Alex: It’s tricky as well because Google kind of are putting themselves on a clock with this. You get 12 months of Gemini Advanced included and the nice cherry here is you also get two terabytes of Google Cloud Storage in that tier because not because they’re sweetening this particular phone. It’s actually because that’s part of the Gemini Advanced plan. You don’t have to buy this phone to get Gemini Advanced but after that you’re on the hook for $32.99 and that’s per month

Leigh: Per month, that’s right. And it gets expensive and I know Samsung has said at the end of next year that its AI features will probably cost money. They haven’t said how much but they have said our cost is coming but they’ve actually said that’s a while off. This is basically one year of knowledge that you have this for a year and after that 33 dollars a month is not an inexpensive amount of pay on top for a feature that you may or may not be using. Now, the upside I guess is that you’re getting the pixel and you’ve got a year to try out. Whether Gemini is good for you, but again, it’s worth pointing out. AI is only going to get better from this point in time. So, You can still use it a year from now, okay, I get that but you’re probably going to get the least amount of use now compared to maybe a year when it’s refined and better.

Alex: Yeah, absolutely. And that is a genuine review challenge. This could be a very different phone in six months, in 12 months. It might not be. My general advice is always to people buy what it can do now because what while we can say AI should get better, it might not get better in a way that is meaningful to you. But speaking and very briefly touching on features that we kind of wish were there, or wish were coming, you know this is coming Leigh, millimetre wave. It was on the pixel 8 Pro, it’s not on this and I am ticked off.

Leigh: Yeah, I actually don’t blame you um and I find it frustrating so Millimetre wave should be here. It’s simply because it’s been on all previous. Major pixels on the six, the six Pro. Sorry, the six Pro it’s on the pro model. So and it was something that Telstra and Vodafone could actually take advantage of because they both have millimetre wave networks in this country. So, clearly Australians do want it. Even in short, amounts, it technically exists and Google have removed it from this model despite the fact that you can get millimetre wave models outside the country. Because other countries use millimetre wave more than we do. I’m surprised Google removed it largely because it was there, they were leading the charge whether or not the market necessarily saw more phones with it wasn’t the point you could use it if you had it. Now, the only millimetre wave phones are the old models which is confusing.

Alex: The best millimetre wave phone we’ve got is the pixel 8 Pro and what hits me more than just oh well, we’ve got Millimetre wave in Australia, which we do and to be fair, not much. But Australians travel. If you travel to the states with this phone that I’m holding. Well, I’m going to wonder how you stole off me in the first place, but leaving that aside, if you travel with this model of this phone, you won’t be able to access the same networks and speeds as they will if you bought this phone in the states, but you bring that here and yeah, it’ll still work fine on our sub 6 networks. That feels like bad value to me and surely Google is only saving like maybe a few cents per chip on the rest of the world phones. There’s some weird variants for France and Japan and I think Belgium as well. It hurts!

Leigh: But I think Google’s reasoning… You asked about this at the launch, and I think Google’s reason of the market doesn’t, you know, demand anymore. I don’t know if that’s true because I highly doubt either Telstra or Vodafone would invest the millions it would take to actually put millimetre wave on the networks, only to find hey, the market doesn’t demand it. I’m confused by that.

Alex: I think what they’re talking about is the market is, oh, Samsung and Apple have got away without offering millimetre wave to Australians so we can too.

Leigh: I mean but for the past three years Google did lead by example.

Alex: I wish they would.

Leigh: When we asked Samsung this the s24 Ultra launch earlier in the year and they said they just didn’t see it being basically used in the country but Google did. Thee devices were out there. Google should have kept doing that.

Alex: You’re not wrong.

Leigh: It should be in this device simply because it was actually a useful included feature. It’s far more useful than the temperature sensor on the back which nobody uses and still here, by the way, it’s still it’s right there and and the and the the app has changed the app is actually slightly more refined, so Google’s investing time on that but for some reason has removed millimetre wave on a phone that actually would benefit from that.

Alex: Yeah, I still can’t work out a really good use case for the temperature sensor, it’s just there but shifting along Leigh You’re a man who has forgotten more about photography than I will ever know.

Leigh: What, with all the cameras behind me?

Alex: Yeah. I found the camera story for this phone was an interesting one, because we’ve got the hardware, and then we’ve got the AI stuff. So, how did you find the hardware?

Leigh: The hardware is exceptional. I mean, you expect the hardware to be good. Google is very good at building a phone camera. We’ve seen fantastic phone cameras even dating back to the four. The four was actually still an exceptional pixel with exceptional camera. I still can’t believe that you can get Astro photography working on a camera that old and that inexpensive at the time. All that stuff is here. I like the combination that you’ve got a 50 megapixel main with a fairly low aperture. You’ve got a 48 megapixel working with Ultra wide and 5x. Solid photos. I think both of those work really well. I think the macro surprised me because it was very detailed, but it got soft. Remarkably easy. I found actually the iPhone’s macro was much easier to control than the pixels,

Alex: You’ve got some astonishingly good macro shots in your review.

Leigh: Thank you.

Alex: We’ll put links to all of the reviews that we’ve done in the description below. Please go and have a look at those, but these macro shots, they’re just excellent.

Leigh: The focal distance control on this is not bad, but if you look at the images, the sharpest points are one point of the focal range, I found it remarkably easy that it would soften and blur everything else. That’s not something I see on the on the iPhone’s equivalent, the iPhones seem to get sharper shots in macro than what I was seeing on here. But I need to do way more testing with this, but overall, like the images are superb, this is exactly what you’d expect out of a Google pixel camera. It is a top-notch, camera. I don’t think it’s light years ahead of what I saw last year. I’ve had someone ask me the other day, and I couldn’t tell him until this morning. And I told him this morning. So what do you think about the pixel 8 Pro camera versus nine? I said if you’ve got the 8 Pro there’s literally no reason to upgrade except maybe if you want macro shots.

Alex: So I think I mean, I think personally, I think the year on year upgrade argument really only makes sense to the people who feel like they have to have the latest and greatest. It doesn’t make Financial sense. And it doesn’t really often make performance sense either.

Leigh: No, you’re absolutely right. So, the, like, the camera here is exceptional. The software is where things get interesting to me, because as you said, the AI, and some Ai and lack of AI is where things are actually unusual for me, because for instance, we had a super blue moon the other week, and I thought it was a really interesting test to actually take the iPhone, the Galaxy S24 Ultra, which has a neat trick for that

Alex: It’s called AI cheating.

Leigh: Yeah. It’s AI cheating. You’re not wrong and now the AI in this phone could not work out how to actually lower the brightness. Even I was forcing it to. The iPhone clearly couldn’t. iPhones aren’t very good with bright moonshots. But of course, Samsung’s AI addition to that could because it’s cheating for people who don’t know, Samsung’s Galaxy S24 Ultra is trained on a view of the Moon, which we can only see from planet Earth. So when you take a photo, it takes a sample of that image and gives you a created version of the moon, even from your point of view, kind of juxtapose in the sky that you have.

Alex: So now I want someone on the ISS to like, take a photo from there, just to see what Samsung’s AI does!

Leigh: Probably wouldn’t work, but they’re also given Nikons to go up there with anyway. They’ve got better cameras. But yeah, that’s the point. So you’re always going to get a decent shot with the AI in Samsung’s s24 Ultra, and some of the previous models, you won’t get the AI infiltrating in in those ways on the pixel which I actually felt thought was rather interesting given it could have but there are AI editing tools in here like turning parts of your scene into something else. One of the craziest ones, I had an example of was, I took a picture of an empty plate on my dinner table, and was able to turn it into a plate of pasta. And I was able to fill my plate digitally with things that shouldn’t be there. Until my daughter said, can you put a cooked frog on my plate? I was like, okay, sure. And we could, we could put a cooked frog on the plate.

Alex: How very French!

Leigh: Right, totally, perfect timing for the Paris Olympics. So you’ve got some AI features that feel like they don’t really benefit anything beyond having fun. They don’t actually result in better quality images.

Alex: I had some issues there partially because some of the stuff — this is reimagine we’re talking about here — partially because some of the images it produced were your classic AI horror shows of of weird things. It turned one of my cats into this mangy lion puppet hybrid. It’s just all — people go have a look at the photo and in the review. So that there’s partially that problem, I also don’t like that even the ones that I’ve seen, now, that do look good. I mean some of yours do look reasonably realistic, they’re not tagged that way. And for example, when you do that with Samsung’s AI, it actually watermarks, like does it attach text at the bottom that it’s AI created. I believe that there may be something tagged in the metadata to indicate it. But I’d much rather have something on screen to say elements of this aren’t real.

Leigh: Basically, yeah, I don’t disagree with you and it’s really bizarre as well. When you think about that because Google is championing a AI ahead of time and we’re it’s weird that Samsung actually has that watermark before anyone else. I imagine an Adobe version would be quite similar because Adobe’s been very forthcoming, with putting like, watermarks on its own gear. I haven’t checked the metadata, I’ll be honest, I haven’t looked through it that comprehensively. I find it interesting that one of the features, I’m not sure if you noticed this between the standard pixel 9 and the pixel 9 Pro Pro XL is just the pro mode in the software. And I found that really unusual because what like I I got stuck in the price and then we’ll get into this in a second. But one of the things that actually I found weird was that the pro mode which does exist on this phone allows you to change ISO, which is largely meaningless on the device like this and shutter speed and things like that. That’s the pro feature, effectively Beyond the telephoto lens. And that’s pretty much it that separates these two devices, the pixel, 9 pixel, 9, Pro itself which I found odd because a lot of people aren’t going to care about the telephoto, sorry, the Pro mode, and even on this Pro phone, you largely don’t rely on it. You have to actually kind of dig to find it and it just doesn’t seem like it could have been implemented that well.

Alex: Yeah, I mean I I don’t disagree with you, I think the people who are going to care about the pro mode settings probably want a better camera anyway in a sense and not that this is a bad camera. Whereas the telephoto on this, a lot more people are going to care about. Actually this brings me into another AI feature, which actually I thought worked really well which is the whole Zoom enhanced thing. So this thing does up to 30 times Zoom and once you get up to that kind of zoom on pretty much any smartphone, you’re getting pretty rubbishy kind of images without a tripod and even with one, they’re not great. And this does AI sharpening in essence. And I was surprised at how well it worked. A lot of the shots that I took that I thought “Okay, yep. That’s typical 30 times” shot. Okay. Well, let’s zoom enhance it. And it’s fairly intelligent that bit of AI functions quite well, I found the other sharpening does seem to do a decent job.

Leigh: Yeah, I tested this even without that without zooming in and I could actually see on macros. It was actually over sharpening things ever so slightly, which isn’t a bad thing and sometimes it’s quite beneficial. But again, you can also, if you, if you need to switch to like a 50 megapixel mode or the high res mode and that should effectively turn this sort of feature off, so it is good to see that you’ve got these options there to make the camera experience better than just say the standard 12 megapixel downsampling that you might expect.

Alex: OK, I’m going to wrap this up, because we’ve been at this a while, and I do want people to have the time to actually go and read our reviews and watch my video reviews and so on. But I will say, I thought you were probably a little bit more positive than I was about this phone. I don’t hate this phone. I think the hardware is really good. The AI side and the cost of AI bugs me, probably a little more than you. But we should talk about cost because I think that is the other problem with this phone or potential problem with this phone.

Leigh: I mean, the models we were sent are two thousand dollar phones So it’s worth pointing out that this is this is a little bit less expensive I guess than the comparable iPhone. Which is the obvious one to compare it against but by the same token the next iPhone is literally about to come out and it’s more likely that Apple will keep the price the same. But you’re going, you’re about to get a whole stack of new features that possibly are better than this one. Keeping the price on there though. This is more expensive than previous Pixel Pro Models. That to me is a bit of a problem because Google has always cemented itself as kind of like the leader/underdog, that was willing to actually beat the competition. Both on price and everything else.

Alex: Yeah, and I mean, the Galaxy s24 Ultra and okay, we’re what, maybe four months away four, four-five months away from its successor coming out.

Leigh: Yeah.

Alex: But the S24 Ultra can fairly easily or regularly be seen on sale at similar prices to this, maybe even a little cheaper because it’s a slightly older phone and as you say that that point where you could say, well the pixel’s not quite as fast but it’s so much cheaper. It’s gone now that that advantage that Google had is gone, and I think that makes for a challenging Market position for them. It makes it a challenging thing to say, go out and absolutely buy this. I was very keen last year, I said as much, I thought the pixel 8 Pro was an excellent phone for the money because it was, whereas, I think this is just a good phone for a lot of money.

Leigh: Yeah, I don’t disagree the value on this one kind of stumps me again. Also, that Pixel 9, like it’s actually technically better value. Still more expensive than I think it should be to be honest. I feel like the pixel 9, the models underneath should be less expensive than what they are. I feel like Google has said, hey, we we know we’re as premium as the rest of everyone else. We can now afford that and that’s, I guess… look, that’s totally Google’s choice to do that. But as you said, s24 Ultra is pretty much the other major Android phone to consider in Australia this year and it is a can be found for a little bit less. If not the same, but comes with a faster chip comes with in a capable or as capable, if not more capable camera system based on its 200 megapixel sensor and has that really excellent S Pen feature. If you need it. That was one of the things I that I felt like I wanted to add to my review but I couldn’t find the right paragraph to do it. I love this phone, don’t get me wrong. You are right, I’m more positive than you but one of the things that actually bothered me about it was that there’s no major WOW feature that kind of separates it from everything else. It’s just a phone with a great camera, and it’s a well-rounded package, which I did write about, but sometimes that’s not enough. The iPhone actually does incredible video, does some really cool things with that ProRes capability. This doesn’t have prores. This doesn’t have any raw video capability whatsoever and it doesn’t have Qi2 which really bothered me. Because if anything should have had Qi2 this year, it should have been the last major Android release of this year, whereas the S Pen doesn’t have qi2 that’s true. It should have had it as well. But it has an S Pen. It gives you that something extra to you can use the phone with. And that’s what I thought was lacking about this. It is a fantastic phone. As you said, I am more positive than you on this and I’m still not sure the value is right. But it doesn’t have some incredible Wow feature that makes you go “Hey, Pixel over everything else.” It’s just probably the best Android all round right now.

Alex: Yeah, look, I think that’s, I think that’s fair, and I agree with you and I did I did write to a certain extent about the lack of Qi2 and I’m surprising to note today of all days that we’ve actually had the announcement of the first Qi2 phone. I’ve already done a very short video on this today as well and it’s HMD! I did not see that coming because while they do some really interesting things in market, they’re not usually technology leaders in that way.

Leigh: Now a phone that costs under a thousand dollars having the new wireless standard that’s been only so far on an iPhone had me to totally stumped, but there’s and we’ve, we’ve spoken about this before online. This should have had Qi2. Simply because it’s got a glass back there and there’s nothing stopping Google, beyond price.

Alex: They built this to a price but it feels like they don’t want to subsidise it to the same extent. But anyway, what people should now do is go and check out Leigh’s review at pickr.com. Go and check out my review at alexreviewstech.com and of course, on this very YouTube channel. You’ll find a whole slew of pixel 9 Pro XL content. Thanks to everyone. Well, first of all, thanks to you Leigh for joining me for this.

Leigh: Thank you for having me.

Alex: And thanks everyone for watching. We’ll grab you next time.

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